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[Music]

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hello and welcome to episode number 54

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of the point of convergence podcast as

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always i am your host exo academian

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over the last several months we've been

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discussing how the totality of the data

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behind the ufo phenomenon may include

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different patterns that perhaps suggest

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that different actors and agendas serve

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as distinct parts of that whole

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distinguishing segments within the meta

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category known as the ufo phenomenon can

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perhaps help us to better understand

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what's actually going on

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within that totality for instance is a

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subsection of data involving apparent

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alien abduction

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here we're speaking about human beings

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first encountering evidently non-human

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corporeal entities in their homes as

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well as elsewhere and subsequently being

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taken by these aliens on board what

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appeared to be spacecraft

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once on board these apparent

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otherworldly craft these individuals

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often find that strange invasive and

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frequently uncomfortable medical

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procedures are performed

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while medical treatment for various

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conditions that may be ailing these

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abductees is sometimes the goal

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much more often the medical procedures

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seem to revolve around some kind of vast

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reproductive scheme

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often as part of what appears to be a

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wide reaching hybridization program

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where offspring who are part human and

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part gray alien appeared to be being

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bred and then raised by these non-human

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others

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the data we've gathered over the decades

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on these kinds of encounters also

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suggests that these interactions between

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these non-human alien others and usually

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individual human beings begin early in

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childhood even though it's sometimes

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only in adulthood that these early

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memories are successfully retrieved

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sometimes as a result of some kind of

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triggering associative event or via the

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aid of therapeutic tools such as

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hypnotic regression

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these particular kinds of experience for

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accounts are widespread

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the fact that these particular alien

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abduction experiences share so many

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common data points suggest we can really

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learn a lot by really embarking on a

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close examination of the evidence

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and that's precisely what we'll be doing

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over the next several episodes

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to begin that process we'll be delving

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into a specific case that fits well

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within the boundaries of this particular

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kind of experience for account

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terry lovelace is a man who's

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encountered these grey aliens since

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childhood

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that ongoing but usually intermittent

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interaction took a shocking turn when he

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was a young man in the military

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events in one particular scenario

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depicted in his book incident at delos

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den

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seem to suggest these alien graves have

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wielded an alarming and overarching

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control over his behavior intentions

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perception and memory

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a deep dive into the astonishing but

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revealing and all too familiar case of

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terry lovelace alien abductee

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is the topic of this the 54th episode of

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[Music]

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as we begin this week's episode i would

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just like to state again that we

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shouldn't prematurely assume that

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superficial differences equate the clear

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demarcation of distinct patterns

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revealing different groups with

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different agendas within the ufo

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phenomenon

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but nevertheless it is a worthwhile

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endeavor to as we pursue the totality of

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the data to keep our eye out for such

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possibilities

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and speaking of perusing the data we're

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going to discuss an alien abduction

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account today and go into in some detail

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over a couple of different episodes

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actually because i really want to focus

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in on this kind of case because there

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are so many like it there are so many

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common data points as i pointed out in

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the introduction

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now we're talking today about terry

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lovelace and his account much of this is

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recorded in his book incident at devil's

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den

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this book recounts an astonishing case

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of alien abduction

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along with a subsequently intense

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investigation by the usaf office of

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special investigations

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now who is terry lovelace

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he is yet another one of the countless

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people all around the world who have

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endured these experiences these are

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average people it happens to a wide

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swath of our population

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in lovelace's case after his time in the

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military he would go on to a successful

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career in law as a felony prosecutor

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eventually becoming an assistant

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attorney general for the u.s territory

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of american samoa and state's attorney

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for vermont's board of medical practice

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that's what he went on to do after his

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time in the military

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but we want to begin this investigation

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the coverage of this case by focusing in

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on lovelace's childhood and an incident

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that happened while he was in the

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military again recounted in his book

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incident at devil's den

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now in this book lovelace actually jumps

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around a fair bit but i think it's

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helpful to retell the events in

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chronological order because it helps us

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understand what actually happened in

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terms of the timeline

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now for lovelace this began in childhood

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as it does for many abductees and

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contactees in lovelace's case when he

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was a child in the 1960s he would

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experience what he called monkey men

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suddenly appearing in his room these

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were small beings clearly not human that

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he believed in retrospect were grey

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aliens but they would wear a strange

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disguise trying to appear something like

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monkeys apparently because they thought

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that would scare him less

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now speaking of that part of the

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interesting dilemma we run into when we

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think about encounters between human

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beings and these alien others is how

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often they seem to have sometimes it

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appears a not very robust understanding

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of human behavior and human psychology

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one can't help but wonder why they don't

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appear differently so as to not surprise

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us not to shock us so much

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perhaps this is because they just are so

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different than us

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and don't understand our psychology even

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after this much time when they've been

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studying us again perhaps this is not

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surprising considering we're a different

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species entirely but let me quote from a

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section in the book where lovelace

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recounts being interrogated by his

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mother after he had one of these

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encounters with these monkey men who

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were actually small grey aliens

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quoting from the book quote

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apologetically i began mom i'm sorry

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about last night it just scared me so

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bad she said

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terry i need you to tell me about these

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nightmares so your dad and i can help

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you what do these monkeys do that scares

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you

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mom they want me to come with them like

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i told you before there are four of them

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and they're all wearing a mask they all

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wear the same mask too i said trying to

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explain something so bizarre with a

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limited vocabulary of an eight-year-old

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she pleaded help me understand are you

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afraid of all monkeys like the ones at

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the zoo or monkeys on the tv

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no mom it's just these four same monkeys

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that come in my room they look like real

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monkeys but not like on tv

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these are the monkey men the monkey men

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scare me they want me to go with them

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sometimes i think i'll go sometimes i

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even think i went with them before i

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said

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my mother pressed on but you know

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monkeys can't hurt you have you tried

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telling them to go away

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you just tell them you don't want to

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play with them anymore you can do that

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you can tell them to leave you alone and

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order them to get out you can do that

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okay mama i'll try i'll tell them to get

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out of my room and leave me alone i'm

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afraid that they might take me away with

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them and i might not be able to come

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home

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i was crying now

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honey i i don't know you just must try

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we'll leave the hall light on at night

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now but you can't sleep with mom and dad

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anymore it's not fair to wake up your

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sisters by screaming either

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unquote

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now in that small section i just read

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from

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we understand how difficult this must

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have been for a young terry for an

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eight-year-old to try to explain to his

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mother what's really been going on

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parents it seems sometimes think that

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children going through these kinds of

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things are confusing fantasy with

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reality

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the parents assume perhaps he's watched

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tv that he shouldn't have seen too many

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sci-fi shows or been scared by monkeys

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he's seen at the zoo and that this is

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coming into his nightmares manifesting

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as nightmares

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but he clearly is cogent here he's

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saying no this is not a nightmare this

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is happening in my manifest reality

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again though that he doesn't have those

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terms to use this is what he's trying to

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explain to her

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but in her response and even more so in

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his father's response that we'll see

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later it's clear that they're getting

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frustrated because they already are a

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priori assuming these events can't be

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happening as they've been described as

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happening by this eight-year-old

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so terry like many children in his place

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over the course of history is between a

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rock and a hard place he desperately

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wants help he wants understanding but he

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also doesn't want to upset his parents

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anymore knowing that they already

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believe he is mistaking fantasy for

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reality and just causing too much

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familial disruption

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but i want you to think about the

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setting 1960s americana

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and what it must be like for terry when

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he has these kinds of experiences

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and that cues the next experience we're

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going to discuss when he sees a ufo in

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broad daylight

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quitting from the book again quote

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i was in the backyard shooting arrows

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into a block of hay i was proud this was

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an adult bow and arrow set for target

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shooting looking back i'd never give one

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of my children such a lethal weapon when

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they were eight it really was a

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different time in so many ways back then

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while i was loading an arrow's notch

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onto my bowstring i saw a dark shadow

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move across the grass under my feet

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i assumed it was a cloud

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but the shadow made a perfect circle i

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looked up there was a large silver disc

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shaped object directly over my head

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i was dumbstruck

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my eyes tried to take in all the details

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my mind raced through everything i knew

282
00:10:52,550 --> 00:10:49,839
about things that could fly

283
00:10:54,550 --> 00:10:52,560
what could this be could it hurt me

284
00:10:56,790 --> 00:10:54,560
airplanes and helicopters i immediately

285
00:10:59,030 --> 00:10:56,800
dismissed the only thing left on my

286
00:11:01,910 --> 00:10:59,040
mental checklist was perhaps a balloon

287
00:11:04,069 --> 00:11:01,920
or dirigible of some sort

288
00:11:06,790 --> 00:11:04,079
but balloons are not made of aluminum

289
00:11:08,630 --> 00:11:06,800
and dirigibles aren't round

290
00:11:10,150 --> 00:11:08,640
balloons don't sit perfectly still in

291
00:11:11,750 --> 00:11:10,160
the spring breeze

292
00:11:14,790 --> 00:11:11,760
whatever this was it was something i'd

293
00:11:16,870 --> 00:11:14,800
never seen before i was overwhelmed it

294
00:11:18,949 --> 00:11:16,880
was exciting too

295
00:11:20,630 --> 00:11:18,959
this thing made no noise and wobbled

296
00:11:22,710 --> 00:11:20,640
slightly in the breeze

297
00:11:24,230 --> 00:11:22,720
i'd estimate it was no more than 50 feet

298
00:11:26,389 --> 00:11:24,240
over my head

299
00:11:28,389 --> 00:11:26,399
for some odd reason i felt compelled to

300
00:11:30,790 --> 00:11:28,399
put down my bow and lie down on the

301
00:11:32,550 --> 00:11:30,800
freshly mowed lawn and stare up at the

302
00:11:34,710 --> 00:11:32,560
thing for a better view

303
00:11:36,949 --> 00:11:34,720
in hindsight of course that made no

304
00:11:39,030 --> 00:11:36,959
sense but that's what i did and that

305
00:11:40,949 --> 00:11:39,040
puzzles me to this day

306
00:11:43,110 --> 00:11:40,959
this thing was amazingly beautiful it

307
00:11:45,750 --> 00:11:43,120
was shiny and gorgeous in the way a

308
00:11:48,150 --> 00:11:45,760
brand new sports car is gorgeous

309
00:11:49,990 --> 00:11:48,160
i called the body silver at the time it

310
00:11:52,550 --> 00:11:50,000
could have been highly polished aluminum

311
00:11:54,710 --> 00:11:52,560
or god knows what its edges curled

312
00:11:56,389 --> 00:11:54,720
upward but otherwise it was perfectly

313
00:11:58,389 --> 00:11:56,399
flat like a pancake

314
00:12:00,150 --> 00:11:58,399
i remember being sorely disappointed i

315
00:12:02,470 --> 00:12:00,160
couldn't see the top of it

316
00:12:04,629 --> 00:12:02,480
i wanted to see if there were windows

317
00:12:06,389 --> 00:12:04,639
on a bottom there were no openings or

318
00:12:08,470 --> 00:12:06,399
doorways of any kind

319
00:12:10,629 --> 00:12:08,480
no seams or rivets

320
00:12:13,430 --> 00:12:10,639
there wasn't an exhaust pipe there was

321
00:12:17,990 --> 00:12:13,440
nothing printed on it i expected to see

322
00:12:20,550 --> 00:12:18,000
usaf or even cccp painted on the bottom

323
00:12:22,629 --> 00:12:20,560
there were no insignias or numbers

324
00:12:25,190 --> 00:12:22,639
the bottom was one seamless piece of

325
00:12:27,509 --> 00:12:25,200
shiny metal having assembled more than a

326
00:12:29,350 --> 00:12:27,519
few plastic model planes i had a vague

327
00:12:30,389 --> 00:12:29,360
idea of how mechanical things were put

328
00:12:31,990 --> 00:12:30,399
together

329
00:12:33,509 --> 00:12:32,000
i thought there should be rivets or

330
00:12:35,350 --> 00:12:33,519
seams visible

331
00:12:36,790 --> 00:12:35,360
whatever this was it had to have been

332
00:12:38,629 --> 00:12:36,800
put together

333
00:12:40,150 --> 00:12:38,639
i wish there were windows so i could see

334
00:12:41,509 --> 00:12:40,160
who was driving

335
00:12:42,949 --> 00:12:41,519
there could be a dome or something

336
00:12:44,389 --> 00:12:42,959
sitting on the top

337
00:12:47,509 --> 00:12:44,399
where did the wheels come down if it

338
00:12:49,590 --> 00:12:47,519
wants to land my mind continued racing

339
00:12:52,470 --> 00:12:49,600
this is anecdotal but there was an odd

340
00:12:55,430 --> 00:12:52,480
static electric charge in the air i felt

341
00:12:57,509 --> 00:12:55,440
the fine hairs on my forearms stand up

342
00:12:59,350 --> 00:12:57,519
i could smell the freshly mowed grass

343
00:13:01,190 --> 00:12:59,360
and ionized air

344
00:13:03,670 --> 00:13:01,200
it was the scent of fresh air after a

345
00:13:05,350 --> 00:13:03,680
thunderstorm mixed with the sweet smell

346
00:13:07,190 --> 00:13:05,360
of the cut grass

347
00:13:08,790 --> 00:13:07,200
there was a change in the acoustics as

348
00:13:10,550 --> 00:13:08,800
well i remember that the whole

349
00:13:12,949 --> 00:13:10,560
neighborhood was silent

350
00:13:15,670 --> 00:13:12,959
there were no cars or tvs blaring from

351
00:13:17,829 --> 00:13:15,680
open windows there was nothing

352
00:13:20,389 --> 00:13:17,839
i lay flat on my back looking up with a

353
00:13:22,949 --> 00:13:20,399
mixture of fear and amazement this was

354
00:13:25,350 --> 00:13:22,959
something new it was broad daylight in a

355
00:13:27,350 --> 00:13:25,360
neighborhood usually full of children

356
00:13:29,590 --> 00:13:27,360
surely dozens of people were staring at

357
00:13:32,069 --> 00:13:29,600
this thing just like me at that very

358
00:13:33,990 --> 00:13:32,079
minute unquote

359
00:13:36,069 --> 00:13:34,000
now this section i just read from

360
00:13:38,870 --> 00:13:36,079
demonstrates just how bizarre how

361
00:13:40,550 --> 00:13:38,880
amazing these incidents can be

362
00:13:42,550 --> 00:13:40,560
because this is happening in broad

363
00:13:44,310 --> 00:13:42,560
daylight when there are undoubtedly

364
00:13:46,150 --> 00:13:44,320
other people around including other

365
00:13:48,470 --> 00:13:46,160
children in the neighborhood

366
00:13:50,710 --> 00:13:48,480
and not surprisingly a young terry

367
00:13:52,629 --> 00:13:50,720
lovelace assumes that other people are

368
00:13:54,710 --> 00:13:52,639
seeing this as well

369
00:13:57,670 --> 00:13:54,720
we should also note here the smell of

370
00:13:59,430 --> 00:13:57,680
ionization and a sense of a magnetic

371
00:14:01,350 --> 00:13:59,440
charge in the air

372
00:14:03,590 --> 00:14:01,360
all of these elements are quite common

373
00:14:06,389 --> 00:14:03,600
in these kinds of experiences

374
00:14:08,870 --> 00:14:06,399
now speaking of that people like dr hal

375
00:14:10,550 --> 00:14:08,880
put up when discussing these specific

376
00:14:13,030 --> 00:14:10,560
kinds of elements that are common to

377
00:14:15,670 --> 00:14:13,040
these kinds of cases have suggested that

378
00:14:18,069 --> 00:14:15,680
perhaps time has been slowed at this

379
00:14:21,430 --> 00:14:18,079
point by these others which effectively

380
00:14:23,509 --> 00:14:21,440
makes the ufo invisible to others but

381
00:14:25,269 --> 00:14:23,519
that manipulation of the environment

382
00:14:27,189 --> 00:14:25,279
shows up in the way that people who are

383
00:14:29,750 --> 00:14:27,199
experiencers pick up that kind of

384
00:14:31,990 --> 00:14:29,760
ionized smell and that magnetic charge

385
00:14:35,030 --> 00:14:32,000
and the fact that the surroundings seem

386
00:14:37,590 --> 00:14:35,040
suddenly uncannily silent

387
00:14:39,509 --> 00:14:37,600
now in regards to put off's hypothesis

388
00:14:40,949 --> 00:14:39,519
that perhaps they are slowing time in

389
00:14:42,870 --> 00:14:40,959
these situations

390
00:14:45,910 --> 00:14:42,880
think about it this way think about

391
00:14:48,389 --> 00:14:45,920
subliminal advertising the idea there is

392
00:14:51,189 --> 00:14:48,399
that advertisers can actually insert

393
00:14:52,949 --> 00:14:51,199
images that appear so quickly between

394
00:14:54,310 --> 00:14:52,959
frames in an image for instance the

395
00:14:55,990 --> 00:14:54,320
video that you see

396
00:14:59,030 --> 00:14:56,000
that your conscious brain doesn't

397
00:15:01,269 --> 00:14:59,040
actually pick up that you saw that image

398
00:15:03,030 --> 00:15:01,279
and yet nevertheless your subconscious

399
00:15:05,509 --> 00:15:03,040
brain will pick it up and it can

400
00:15:07,670 --> 00:15:05,519
actually influence your behavior

401
00:15:09,509 --> 00:15:07,680
and for the advertiser's point of view

402
00:15:11,829 --> 00:15:09,519
hopefully influence what you purchase

403
00:15:13,430 --> 00:15:11,839
later on and again it's very sneaky

404
00:15:15,509 --> 00:15:13,440
because you're not even consciously

405
00:15:16,949 --> 00:15:15,519
aware of the experience you don't even

406
00:15:18,949 --> 00:15:16,959
know it happened

407
00:15:21,509 --> 00:15:18,959
that may be what's happening here that

408
00:15:23,910 --> 00:15:21,519
because time can be manipulated by these

409
00:15:26,550 --> 00:15:23,920
others or perhaps just our perception of

410
00:15:29,189 --> 00:15:26,560
time then they could appear and sit over

411
00:15:31,670 --> 00:15:29,199
top of a experiencer like terry lovelace

412
00:15:33,829 --> 00:15:31,680
for minutes perhaps even hours and yet

413
00:15:36,389 --> 00:15:33,839
for everyone else around perhaps that

414
00:15:38,389 --> 00:15:36,399
happens in a millisecond so quickly that

415
00:15:40,629 --> 00:15:38,399
their conscious brains don't even pick

416
00:15:43,430 --> 00:15:40,639
up that anything was there

417
00:15:45,269 --> 00:15:43,440
it's a fascinating hypothesis and again

418
00:15:47,990 --> 00:15:45,279
it fits with the elements that

419
00:15:50,550 --> 00:15:48,000
experiencers pick up the ionized smell

420
00:15:53,509 --> 00:15:50,560
and the magnetic charge etc

421
00:15:55,350 --> 00:15:53,519
now once this ufo had zoomed off terry

422
00:15:57,590 --> 00:15:55,360
did what every young child is going to

423
00:15:58,629 --> 00:15:57,600
do in a situation like that he ran

424
00:15:59,990 --> 00:15:58,639
inside

425
00:16:01,430 --> 00:16:00,000
hooting and hollering that he'd just

426
00:16:03,269 --> 00:16:01,440
seen a ufo

427
00:16:04,949 --> 00:16:03,279
of course his mother was horrified

428
00:16:06,470 --> 00:16:04,959
because again there's sort of the

429
00:16:09,269 --> 00:16:06,480
keeping up with the jones's kind of

430
00:16:11,350 --> 00:16:09,279
mentality of 1960s americana in their

431
00:16:14,470 --> 00:16:11,360
neighborhood and she was horrified that

432
00:16:16,310 --> 00:16:14,480
her son was saying such things out loud

433
00:16:19,430 --> 00:16:16,320
again the assumption is this is not

434
00:16:22,150 --> 00:16:19,440
going to reflect well on the family and

435
00:16:24,470 --> 00:16:22,160
specifically on their parenting methods

436
00:16:27,189 --> 00:16:24,480
now once terry's father gets home from a

437
00:16:28,870 --> 00:16:27,199
hard day of manual labor his mother

438
00:16:30,389 --> 00:16:28,880
immediately talks to him about what had

439
00:16:31,350 --> 00:16:30,399
just happened and how embarrassing it

440
00:16:33,430 --> 00:16:31,360
was

441
00:16:37,030 --> 00:16:33,440
and the father immediately pulls terry

442
00:16:38,470 --> 00:16:37,040
aside and says the following quote

443
00:16:40,230 --> 00:16:38,480
son you can't walk around the

444
00:16:42,389 --> 00:16:40,240
neighborhood and tell people you saw a

445
00:16:45,829 --> 00:16:42,399
flying saucer they'll think something's

446
00:16:47,030 --> 00:16:45,839
wrong with you or with us understand

447
00:16:48,550 --> 00:16:47,040
yes sir

448
00:16:50,790 --> 00:16:48,560
i could tell my dad had reached his

449
00:16:52,470 --> 00:16:50,800
limit next he would yell at me and i

450
00:16:54,629 --> 00:16:52,480
didn't like being yelled at

451
00:16:55,910 --> 00:16:54,639
he scared me when he yelled it made me

452
00:16:57,590 --> 00:16:55,920
cry

453
00:17:00,069 --> 00:16:57,600
well then let's agree that whatever you

454
00:17:01,749 --> 00:17:00,079
saw it was a shiny jet okay

455
00:17:03,509 --> 00:17:01,759
then we can have some supper and stop

456
00:17:04,630 --> 00:17:03,519
all this nonsense everything will be

457
00:17:07,029 --> 00:17:04,640
okay

458
00:17:09,429 --> 00:17:07,039
now son tell me what you saw he said

459
00:17:12,069 --> 00:17:09,439
leaning back with his arms folded

460
00:17:15,189 --> 00:17:12,079
i did the unthinkable i lied

461
00:17:17,429 --> 00:17:15,199
after a pause i swallowed hard and said

462
00:17:19,429 --> 00:17:17,439
well it could have been a jet

463
00:17:21,590 --> 00:17:19,439
there you see how these things are

464
00:17:23,669 --> 00:17:21,600
sometimes we can't believe our eyes it's

465
00:17:25,829 --> 00:17:23,679
like the monkeys it's all over and done

466
00:17:28,870 --> 00:17:25,839
with now we can put this whole thing to

467
00:17:30,710 --> 00:17:28,880
bed dad said obviously pleased

468
00:17:33,510 --> 00:17:30,720
those would turn out to be a poor choice

469
00:17:35,909 --> 00:17:33,520
of words the flying saucer matter wasn't

470
00:17:38,630 --> 00:17:35,919
put to bed our lies hadn't changed

471
00:17:42,470 --> 00:17:38,640
reality what i saw was not a jet what i

472
00:17:44,310 --> 00:17:42,480
saw was a real flying saucer unquote

473
00:17:46,630 --> 00:17:44,320
now at this point we're going to flash

474
00:17:49,110 --> 00:17:46,640
forward to terry's adulthood his young

475
00:17:51,590 --> 00:17:49,120
adulthood when he's in the military

476
00:17:52,470 --> 00:17:51,600
leading up to his experience at devil's

477
00:17:54,230 --> 00:17:52,480
den

478
00:17:56,310 --> 00:17:54,240
but before we do that i just want to

479
00:17:58,950 --> 00:17:56,320
make note of another element that was

480
00:18:00,630 --> 00:17:58,960
involved with his sighting of the ufo

481
00:18:03,190 --> 00:18:00,640
when he was a boy

482
00:18:06,470 --> 00:18:03,200
notice that he inexplicably decided to

483
00:18:09,110 --> 00:18:06,480
lie down calmly and look up at the ufo

484
00:18:11,110 --> 00:18:09,120
when he first saw it he admits that that

485
00:18:12,870 --> 00:18:11,120
behavior doesn't make any sense to him

486
00:18:15,110 --> 00:18:12,880
it didn't make sense then and it doesn't

487
00:18:17,350 --> 00:18:15,120
make sense now even when he thinks back

488
00:18:19,430 --> 00:18:17,360
on it all these decades later

489
00:18:22,310 --> 00:18:19,440
now of course this is a very common

490
00:18:24,870 --> 00:18:22,320
element of the ufo phenomenon they can

491
00:18:28,230 --> 00:18:24,880
control our behavior they can control

492
00:18:30,470 --> 00:18:28,240
our cognitive processing our neurology

493
00:18:32,470 --> 00:18:30,480
seemingly all of the electrochemical

494
00:18:34,789 --> 00:18:32,480
processes of our brain

495
00:18:37,110 --> 00:18:34,799
can be manipulated by them and this

496
00:18:38,710 --> 00:18:37,120
happens frequently and this is partly

497
00:18:41,110 --> 00:18:38,720
what makes it so difficult for

498
00:18:42,870 --> 00:18:41,120
experiencers to reckon with because they

499
00:18:45,430 --> 00:18:42,880
themselves do things that they can't

500
00:18:47,750 --> 00:18:45,440
explain and when people are already

501
00:18:50,230 --> 00:18:47,760
likely to disbelieve them and assume

502
00:18:52,390 --> 00:18:50,240
that they're lying or making it up or

503
00:18:54,950 --> 00:18:52,400
are mentally unstable

504
00:18:57,190 --> 00:18:54,960
then when they also share behavior that

505
00:19:00,070 --> 00:18:57,200
doesn't make sense even to them

506
00:19:02,950 --> 00:19:00,080
it makes the stories even less credible

507
00:19:05,590 --> 00:19:02,960
to outside sources again this adds to

508
00:19:07,590 --> 00:19:05,600
the stigma and it adds to the mystery of

509
00:19:09,830 --> 00:19:07,600
what's actually going on here and how

510
00:19:11,430 --> 00:19:09,840
these others are actually interacting

511
00:19:13,590 --> 00:19:11,440
with us

512
00:19:16,070 --> 00:19:13,600
all right so now let's flash forward to

513
00:19:18,310 --> 00:19:16,080
when terry is in the military

514
00:19:20,310 --> 00:19:18,320
and has a friend named toby that he's

515
00:19:22,390 --> 00:19:20,320
very close with now terry is just

516
00:19:24,310 --> 00:19:22,400
serving a few years in the military to

517
00:19:26,310 --> 00:19:24,320
pay off his education because he wants

518
00:19:28,950 --> 00:19:26,320
to go on and get a law degree

519
00:19:31,590 --> 00:19:28,960
likewise his friend toby wants to go on

520
00:19:34,310 --> 00:19:31,600
and study astrophysics and in fact

521
00:19:36,070 --> 00:19:34,320
toby's interest in astronomy is partly

522
00:19:39,190 --> 00:19:36,080
what leads them to decide to go to

523
00:19:40,710 --> 00:19:39,200
devil's den which is a state park area

524
00:19:43,190 --> 00:19:40,720
several hours away from where they are

525
00:19:45,270 --> 00:19:43,200
located now part of the reason they

526
00:19:48,710 --> 00:19:45,280
believe they chose that location is

527
00:19:51,510 --> 00:19:48,720
because it is fairly remote which allows

528
00:19:53,350 --> 00:19:51,520
terry to take photography of wildlife

529
00:19:55,990 --> 00:19:53,360
which was a hobby of his

530
00:19:58,150 --> 00:19:56,000
and it would also allow toby to take in

531
00:19:59,190 --> 00:19:58,160
the stars without light pollution from

532
00:20:01,029 --> 00:19:59,200
the city

533
00:20:03,190 --> 00:20:01,039
at least that's their initial sense of

534
00:20:05,270 --> 00:20:03,200
why they chose that location

535
00:20:07,590 --> 00:20:05,280
later on they come to question this

536
00:20:09,669 --> 00:20:07,600
rationality and believe that actually

537
00:20:11,909 --> 00:20:09,679
they were set up to go there that they

538
00:20:13,669 --> 00:20:11,919
were directed to go there basically even

539
00:20:16,549 --> 00:20:13,679
if the direction happened at a

540
00:20:19,190 --> 00:20:16,559
subliminal subconscious level

541
00:20:21,110 --> 00:20:19,200
basically as the story goes neither one

542
00:20:23,110 --> 00:20:21,120
of them had been campers they hadn't

543
00:20:25,590 --> 00:20:23,120
camped in their lifetimes either one of

544
00:20:27,350 --> 00:20:25,600
them and yet toby got in his mind that

545
00:20:28,149 --> 00:20:27,360
they should go camping for the first

546
00:20:29,750 --> 00:20:28,159
time

547
00:20:31,909 --> 00:20:29,760
and that furthermore they should pick

548
00:20:34,390 --> 00:20:31,919
this location which is several hours

549
00:20:36,870 --> 00:20:34,400
away from where they were stationed and

550
00:20:38,310 --> 00:20:36,880
pick a very remote location to again

551
00:20:40,549 --> 00:20:38,320
observe stars

552
00:20:41,750 --> 00:20:40,559
and to allow terry to take pictures of

553
00:20:43,510 --> 00:20:41,760
wildlife

554
00:20:46,470 --> 00:20:43,520
now right off the bat things get very

555
00:20:49,110 --> 00:20:46,480
strange because again terry's main goal

556
00:20:51,750 --> 00:20:49,120
is to take photographs he's a fan of

557
00:20:53,909 --> 00:20:51,760
ansel adams black and white photography

558
00:20:55,350 --> 00:20:53,919
in state parks and of wildlife and he

559
00:20:57,990 --> 00:20:55,360
wants to emulate that kind of

560
00:20:59,510 --> 00:20:58,000
photography but strange as it seems and

561
00:21:01,909 --> 00:20:59,520
it certainly is strange when you think

562
00:21:03,270 --> 00:21:01,919
about what his goals were they leave for

563
00:21:05,350 --> 00:21:03,280
the camping trip

564
00:21:07,909 --> 00:21:05,360
with terry for getting his camera all

565
00:21:10,230 --> 00:21:07,919
together his expensive high-powered

566
00:21:11,590 --> 00:21:10,240
camera gets left behind which is very

567
00:21:13,669 --> 00:21:11,600
interesting

568
00:21:15,990 --> 00:21:13,679
this again happens a lot in the ufo

569
00:21:17,909 --> 00:21:16,000
phenomenon literature people either just

570
00:21:19,909 --> 00:21:17,919
choose not to take pictures for whatever

571
00:21:22,230 --> 00:21:19,919
reason or they forget to bring a camera

572
00:21:24,549 --> 00:21:22,240
at all now again once they get to the

573
00:21:26,710 --> 00:21:24,559
state park area rather than camping with

574
00:21:27,990 --> 00:21:26,720
other people they decide strangely when

575
00:21:30,950 --> 00:21:28,000
you think about the fact that this is

576
00:21:33,190 --> 00:21:30,960
their first time ever camping to go to a

577
00:21:35,350 --> 00:21:33,200
very remote location away from other

578
00:21:37,750 --> 00:21:35,360
people who are camping in fact they're

579
00:21:40,549 --> 00:21:37,760
camping in an illegal area in an area

580
00:21:41,750 --> 00:21:40,559
that is actually closed off from campers

581
00:21:44,230 --> 00:21:41,760
altogether

582
00:21:46,070 --> 00:21:44,240
and to be clear in retrospect terry

583
00:21:48,149 --> 00:21:46,080
already believes this is behavior that

584
00:21:50,230 --> 00:21:48,159
is unexpected for them for either one of

585
00:21:51,750 --> 00:21:50,240
them these are young military men and

586
00:21:53,830 --> 00:21:51,760
they wouldn't want to break the law like

587
00:21:55,350 --> 00:21:53,840
this and so he doesn't understand why

588
00:21:57,830 --> 00:21:55,360
they chose that location he doesn't

589
00:21:59,909 --> 00:21:57,840
believe it was of their volition at all

590
00:22:01,990 --> 00:21:59,919
now a couple of strange events happen

591
00:22:03,909 --> 00:22:02,000
once they get to the campsite

592
00:22:05,990 --> 00:22:03,919
there are two different events in fact

593
00:22:08,230 --> 00:22:06,000
but let's jump forward for a second to

594
00:22:10,310 --> 00:22:08,240
the point where they have set up camp

595
00:22:12,390 --> 00:22:10,320
and they are watching the stars and they

596
00:22:14,310 --> 00:22:12,400
notice something strange in the corner

597
00:22:17,669 --> 00:22:14,320
of their eye what they see is something

598
00:22:20,390 --> 00:22:17,679
that appears triangular and is seemingly

599
00:22:22,710 --> 00:22:20,400
not a star but it seems too big to be

600
00:22:24,789 --> 00:22:22,720
believed in fact they are trying to

601
00:22:27,029 --> 00:22:24,799
ascertain how far away the object

602
00:22:29,270 --> 00:22:27,039
they're seeing actually is and at this

603
00:22:30,789 --> 00:22:29,280
point toby says and here i quote from

604
00:22:33,110 --> 00:22:30,799
the book quote

605
00:22:35,110 --> 00:22:33,120
terry man that thing is in our

606
00:22:37,029 --> 00:22:35,120
atmosphere it can't be outside of this

607
00:22:38,789 --> 00:22:37,039
solar system no way

608
00:22:41,510 --> 00:22:38,799
this thing is close

609
00:22:43,510 --> 00:22:41,520
man i hope it's a cruising height 35 000

610
00:22:45,270 --> 00:22:43,520
feet would make me happy

611
00:22:49,110 --> 00:22:45,280
no i think it looks bigger because it's

612
00:22:51,029 --> 00:22:49,120
getting closer to us it's really close

613
00:22:52,549 --> 00:22:51,039
toby said it first and confirmed what we

614
00:22:55,270 --> 00:22:52,559
were both thinking

615
00:22:56,549 --> 00:22:55,280
that's a single solid object no doubt

616
00:22:59,029 --> 00:22:56,559
about it

617
00:23:00,870 --> 00:22:59,039
watch it pass over a field of stars they

618
00:23:03,669 --> 00:23:00,880
blink out for a second or two and then

619
00:23:05,909 --> 00:23:03,679
blink back on as it goes past

620
00:23:08,549 --> 00:23:05,919
i noticed that too toby

621
00:23:10,630 --> 00:23:08,559
with a feigned laugh i said i think that

622
00:23:12,310 --> 00:23:10,640
damn thing is headed toward us

623
00:23:13,990 --> 00:23:12,320
i think it's coming to sail right over

624
00:23:16,549 --> 00:23:14,000
the top of us

625
00:23:19,350 --> 00:23:16,559
toby didn't say a word once more i

626
00:23:21,669 --> 00:23:19,360
noticed how quiet the entire forest was

627
00:23:24,230 --> 00:23:21,679
the crickets and tree frogs had not

628
00:23:26,710 --> 00:23:24,240
returned as toby had predicted

629
00:23:30,470 --> 00:23:26,720
it wasn't worth mentioning at the time i

630
00:23:33,350 --> 00:23:30,480
felt uneasy but not frightened yet

631
00:23:35,750 --> 00:23:33,360
i asked toby are we safe here

632
00:23:38,070 --> 00:23:35,760
man i sure hope so toby said

633
00:23:39,029 --> 00:23:38,080
after a pause he added what could hurt

634
00:23:40,630 --> 00:23:39,039
us

635
00:23:42,710 --> 00:23:40,640
i wasn't quite sure if that was a

636
00:23:44,149 --> 00:23:42,720
question requiring a reply

637
00:23:46,470 --> 00:23:44,159
i said nothing

638
00:23:48,789 --> 00:23:46,480
we both watched as its path placed it

639
00:23:50,789 --> 00:23:48,799
directly over the meadow then it

640
00:23:53,029 --> 00:23:50,799
abruptly stopped

641
00:23:53,990 --> 00:23:53,039
toby it's not moving anymore is it

642
00:23:55,990 --> 00:23:54,000
nope

643
00:23:57,029 --> 00:23:56,000
it came to a halt directly over our

644
00:23:59,110 --> 00:23:57,039
heads

645
00:24:01,110 --> 00:23:59,120
while we watched the three points of the

646
00:24:03,990 --> 00:24:01,120
triangle spread further and further

647
00:24:05,430 --> 00:24:04,000
apart eating up entire fields of stars

648
00:24:07,430 --> 00:24:05,440
as it grew

649
00:24:09,750 --> 00:24:07,440
in a sky that was loaded with billions

650
00:24:11,909 --> 00:24:09,760
of stars it was like someone cut a giant

651
00:24:14,070 --> 00:24:11,919
triangle out of the sky

652
00:24:16,950 --> 00:24:14,080
this was a single object and it was

653
00:24:18,870 --> 00:24:16,960
enormous the three stars on each point

654
00:24:21,750 --> 00:24:18,880
of the triangle were so bright that the

655
00:24:23,269 --> 00:24:21,760
entire meadow glowed as brilliantly as

656
00:24:25,830 --> 00:24:23,279
the full moon

657
00:24:28,549 --> 00:24:25,840
it was bright enough to cast shadows

658
00:24:30,950 --> 00:24:28,559
all the anxiety had left me once it had

659
00:24:33,750 --> 00:24:30,960
parked over the meadow all emotion left

660
00:24:36,310 --> 00:24:33,760
me we lay on air mattresses completely

661
00:24:38,950 --> 00:24:36,320
fascinated we both just surrendered and

662
00:24:42,149 --> 00:24:38,960
let the calmness wash over us

663
00:24:44,230 --> 00:24:42,159
it was pleasant even soothing

664
00:24:46,470 --> 00:24:44,240
grabbing our marginal flashlight toby

665
00:24:47,909 --> 00:24:46,480
said i'm going to try and signal it and

666
00:24:49,909 --> 00:24:47,919
see what happens

667
00:24:52,390 --> 00:24:49,919
before i could object toby picked up the

668
00:24:54,070 --> 00:24:52,400
flashlight he held in his lap

669
00:24:55,830 --> 00:24:54,080
aiming it straight up he flashed the

670
00:24:57,510 --> 00:24:55,840
light three times

671
00:24:58,630 --> 00:24:57,520
i said man that might get someone's

672
00:25:00,710 --> 00:24:58,640
attention

673
00:25:02,390 --> 00:25:00,720
we waited to see what would happen we

674
00:25:03,430 --> 00:25:02,400
didn't have to wait long for something

675
00:25:05,750 --> 00:25:03,440
to happen

676
00:25:08,149 --> 00:25:05,760
in an instant a beam of white light no

677
00:25:11,269 --> 00:25:08,159
wider than a softball was focused on our

678
00:25:13,190 --> 00:25:11,279
near dead campfire it was about eight

679
00:25:15,669 --> 00:25:13,200
feet from where we lay the light beam

680
00:25:17,990 --> 00:25:15,679
itself was visible like a high-powered

681
00:25:20,070 --> 00:25:18,000
searchlight shining through the fog

682
00:25:21,830 --> 00:25:20,080
we never saw the beam descend it was

683
00:25:22,710 --> 00:25:21,840
like someone threw a switch and there it

684
00:25:25,350 --> 00:25:22,720
was

685
00:25:27,430 --> 00:25:25,360
it rested in the center of our fire pit

686
00:25:28,470 --> 00:25:27,440
looking up we traced the source of the

687
00:25:30,549 --> 00:25:28,480
light beam

688
00:25:33,110 --> 00:25:30,559
it came from below and center of the

689
00:25:36,310 --> 00:25:33,120
triangle it stayed for no more than 30

690
00:25:37,510 --> 00:25:36,320
seconds and was gone poof it just shut

691
00:25:39,669 --> 00:25:37,520
off

692
00:25:42,230 --> 00:25:39,679
a few minutes passed then a blue light

693
00:25:44,789 --> 00:25:42,240
struck the campsite it was tiny compared

694
00:25:47,350 --> 00:25:44,799
to white light but much more intense

695
00:25:48,549 --> 00:25:47,360
it was only the diameter of a pencil or

696
00:25:51,750 --> 00:25:48,559
narrower

697
00:25:53,750 --> 00:25:51,760
lasers were still a new concept in 1977

698
00:25:55,669 --> 00:25:53,760
i'd seen them on television just like

699
00:25:57,830 --> 00:25:55,679
the white light that preceded it this

700
00:25:59,190 --> 00:25:57,840
blue light originated from the center of

701
00:26:01,430 --> 00:25:59,200
the triangle

702
00:26:04,230 --> 00:26:01,440
this intense blue light beam actively

703
00:26:06,710 --> 00:26:04,240
darted around the campsite we never saw

704
00:26:09,190 --> 00:26:06,720
it move instead it would blink out and a

705
00:26:10,870 --> 00:26:09,200
millisecond later it was back on in a

706
00:26:13,430 --> 00:26:10,880
different spot

707
00:26:15,590 --> 00:26:13,440
striking haphazardly it darted all over

708
00:26:17,510 --> 00:26:15,600
our campsite never sitting on anything

709
00:26:19,430 --> 00:26:17,520
for more than a few seconds

710
00:26:22,630 --> 00:26:19,440
it darted back and forth and it had a

711
00:26:24,870 --> 00:26:22,640
hypnotic quality to it as we watched i'm

712
00:26:26,149 --> 00:26:24,880
certain it landed on my leg and chest at

713
00:26:29,110 --> 00:26:26,159
least once

714
00:26:31,590 --> 00:26:29,120
i saw it land on toby once or twice too

715
00:26:34,310 --> 00:26:31,600
then it abruptly stopped it was with us

716
00:26:36,310 --> 00:26:34,320
for no longer than one or two minutes

717
00:26:39,110 --> 00:26:36,320
with a blue light gone we lay there

718
00:26:40,549 --> 00:26:39,120
silent and ambivalent i had no emotion

719
00:26:41,830 --> 00:26:40,559
other than a pleasant feeling of

720
00:26:43,669 --> 00:26:41,840
sedation

721
00:26:45,350 --> 00:26:43,679
this huge thing was still nearly over

722
00:26:46,950 --> 00:26:45,360
the meadow and we just watched it

723
00:26:49,190 --> 00:26:46,960
without comment

724
00:26:51,510 --> 00:26:49,200
then toby said something like show's

725
00:26:53,510 --> 00:26:51,520
over or words to that effect i don't

726
00:26:55,909 --> 00:26:53,520
think i replied those were the last

727
00:26:58,390 --> 00:26:55,919
words spoken between us that evening in

728
00:27:00,549 --> 00:26:58,400
unison we picked up our air mattresses

729
00:27:02,630 --> 00:27:00,559
and crawled into our tent

730
00:27:04,390 --> 00:27:02,640
i felt the need to keep my boots on and

731
00:27:05,990 --> 00:27:04,400
laced up tightly

732
00:27:07,430 --> 00:27:06,000
for that matter i didn't bother to

733
00:27:10,789 --> 00:27:07,440
undress at all

734
00:27:12,789 --> 00:27:10,799
the apathy felt all too familiar these

735
00:27:15,590 --> 00:27:12,799
things whatever they are and whoever

736
00:27:16,789 --> 00:27:15,600
they are controlled our actions and our

737
00:27:18,870 --> 00:27:16,799
emotions

738
00:27:21,029 --> 00:27:18,880
this was the same apathy i experienced

739
00:27:23,430 --> 00:27:21,039
in 1966

740
00:27:25,510 --> 00:27:23,440
thoughts about that 1966 experience

741
00:27:27,750 --> 00:27:25,520
flashed in my mind briefly

742
00:27:29,830 --> 00:27:27,760
i was asleep the moment my head hit the

743
00:27:31,909 --> 00:27:29,840
inflated plastic pillow

744
00:27:34,230 --> 00:27:31,919
the heat was tolerable now almost

745
00:27:37,350 --> 00:27:34,240
pleasant but the force was still dead

746
00:27:38,470 --> 00:27:37,360
silent the only sound was toby snoring

747
00:27:40,070 --> 00:27:38,480
softly

748
00:27:43,190 --> 00:27:40,080
unquote

749
00:27:44,870 --> 00:27:43,200
now as lovelace notes in that section

750
00:27:47,190 --> 00:27:44,880
there were several examples where their

751
00:27:49,430 --> 00:27:47,200
behavior their emotions seem to be

752
00:27:52,070 --> 00:27:49,440
controlled by these others

753
00:27:53,669 --> 00:27:52,080
perhaps the most astonishing aspect here

754
00:27:56,389 --> 00:27:53,679
is that they go to bed without even

755
00:27:58,070 --> 00:27:56,399
unleashing their boots and again

756
00:28:00,830 --> 00:27:58,080
lovelace later believes this is a

757
00:28:03,350 --> 00:28:00,840
direction from them even if it was

758
00:28:05,830 --> 00:28:03,360
subconscious now some time goes on and

759
00:28:08,950 --> 00:28:05,840
then lovelace wakes up and when he wakes

760
00:28:10,950 --> 00:28:08,960
up he becomes aware of his friend

761
00:28:14,630 --> 00:28:10,960
hyperventilating and looking outside the

762
00:28:16,549 --> 00:28:14,640
tent at first terry is disoriented and

763
00:28:19,430 --> 00:28:16,559
isn't sure what's going on this is what

764
00:28:21,669 --> 00:28:19,440
he says about that next event quote it

765
00:28:23,269 --> 00:28:21,679
was the lights that woke me up i first

766
00:28:25,909 --> 00:28:23,279
noticed the bright lights and then the

767
00:28:27,590 --> 00:28:25,919
low bass hum i'd heard before except

768
00:28:29,350 --> 00:28:27,600
this was more intense

769
00:28:31,750 --> 00:28:29,360
some flashes of light were bright enough

770
00:28:33,669 --> 00:28:31,760
to illuminate the tense interior as if

771
00:28:35,830 --> 00:28:33,679
we'd had an overhead light

772
00:28:37,750 --> 00:28:35,840
my eyes were sensitive to the lights

773
00:28:40,710 --> 00:28:37,760
when i maneuvered my body to get to my

774
00:28:43,029 --> 00:28:40,720
knees i realized i was in a lot of pain

775
00:28:46,149 --> 00:28:43,039
every bone in my body ached

776
00:28:48,149 --> 00:28:46,159
i was insanely thirsty and scared too

777
00:28:49,750 --> 00:28:48,159
i couldn't grasp what was happening to

778
00:28:50,630 --> 00:28:49,760
us and it was hard to shake off the

779
00:28:52,710 --> 00:28:50,640
sleep

780
00:28:55,029 --> 00:28:52,720
i finally achieved a crouching position

781
00:28:57,590 --> 00:28:55,039
and my focus turned to toby

782
00:28:59,350 --> 00:28:57,600
toby was on his knees inside the tent he

783
00:29:01,190 --> 00:28:59,360
had opened the tent flap about two

784
00:29:03,590 --> 00:29:01,200
inches and was peering out at something

785
00:29:05,590 --> 00:29:03,600
in the meadow he was crouching down and

786
00:29:06,549 --> 00:29:05,600
captivated by whatever was happening

787
00:29:08,310 --> 00:29:06,559
there

788
00:29:10,549 --> 00:29:08,320
again he muttered something but i

789
00:29:12,389 --> 00:29:10,559
couldn't make out what he was saying

790
00:29:14,070 --> 00:29:12,399
the lights outside were multi-colored

791
00:29:16,149 --> 00:29:14,080
greens and yellow

792
00:29:18,549 --> 00:29:16,159
very bright and in quick doses like a

793
00:29:20,950 --> 00:29:18,559
camera flash or a strobe light

794
00:29:23,029 --> 00:29:20,960
i was awake but still in a fog

795
00:29:25,190 --> 00:29:23,039
i wondered if this could be park rangers

796
00:29:27,110 --> 00:29:25,200
with flashlights or maybe the headlights

797
00:29:28,630 --> 00:29:27,120
of a park service jeep with emergency

798
00:29:30,870 --> 00:29:28,640
lights flashing

799
00:29:32,310 --> 00:29:30,880
but these were multi-colored lights they

800
00:29:34,310 --> 00:29:32,320
just didn't fit

801
00:29:36,470 --> 00:29:34,320
i was struggling to fully wake up i had

802
00:29:38,310 --> 00:29:36,480
to claw my way to consciousness it

803
00:29:40,630 --> 00:29:38,320
wasn't only the lights there was also

804
00:29:42,950 --> 00:29:40,640
that droning sound at first i thought it

805
00:29:44,710 --> 00:29:42,960
was noise made by a generator who would

806
00:29:47,669 --> 00:29:44,720
be running a generator in the bed of a

807
00:29:49,750 --> 00:29:47,679
pickup truck game poachers maybe the

808
00:29:51,510 --> 00:29:49,760
flashes of light illuminated the inside

809
00:29:52,950 --> 00:29:51,520
of the tent just enough to catch an

810
00:29:55,430 --> 00:29:52,960
image now and then

811
00:29:56,470 --> 00:29:55,440
i saw toby was trembling like a man in

812
00:29:59,269 --> 00:29:56,480
the cold

813
00:30:01,110 --> 00:29:59,279
i realized i was trembling too i reached

814
00:30:02,870 --> 00:30:01,120
for the flashlight and toby roughly

815
00:30:04,789 --> 00:30:02,880
snatched it from my hand

816
00:30:06,870 --> 00:30:04,799
he held his finger across his lips and

817
00:30:09,909 --> 00:30:06,880
whispered be quiet they're still out

818
00:30:11,909 --> 00:30:09,919
there i was shocked in the flashes of

819
00:30:14,710 --> 00:30:11,919
light i could see tracks down toby's

820
00:30:17,269 --> 00:30:14,720
cheeks he'd been crying this is a man i

821
00:30:19,269 --> 00:30:17,279
knew well we were first responders and

822
00:30:20,950 --> 00:30:19,279
we'd been through some dangerous moments

823
00:30:23,029 --> 00:30:20,960
together as a team

824
00:30:25,590 --> 00:30:23,039
toby could be relied upon to keep his

825
00:30:27,909 --> 00:30:25,600
head and not panic in an emergency

826
00:30:29,909 --> 00:30:27,919
this felt like an emergency what could

827
00:30:31,990 --> 00:30:29,919
move toby to tears

828
00:30:33,029 --> 00:30:32,000
toby continued to shush me when i tried

829
00:30:34,950 --> 00:30:33,039
to speak

830
00:30:37,029 --> 00:30:34,960
with my voice just above a whisper i

831
00:30:39,909 --> 00:30:37,039
asked toby what is it tell me what's

832
00:30:41,830 --> 00:30:39,919
wrong are there park rangers outside

833
00:30:43,430 --> 00:30:41,840
toby shook his head no and stayed

834
00:30:45,029 --> 00:30:43,440
fixated on whatever was happening

835
00:30:46,870 --> 00:30:45,039
outside our tent

836
00:30:48,789 --> 00:30:46,880
i noticed his breathing was shallow and

837
00:30:51,110 --> 00:30:48,799
quick nearly panting

838
00:30:52,950 --> 00:30:51,120
i kept my voice at a whisper

839
00:30:55,110 --> 00:30:52,960
toby man you got to slow your breathing

840
00:30:57,590 --> 00:30:55,120
down you're hyperventilating toby you've

841
00:31:00,310 --> 00:30:57,600
got to tell me what's going on damn it

842
00:31:01,990 --> 00:31:00,320
then i froze i was startled by motion

843
00:31:03,750 --> 00:31:02,000
outside the tent

844
00:31:05,830 --> 00:31:03,760
there were shadows crossing between the

845
00:31:07,509 --> 00:31:05,840
tent and the source of the lights i

846
00:31:10,230 --> 00:31:07,519
heard footsteps too

847
00:31:12,070 --> 00:31:10,240
there was a rustling of leaves and grass

848
00:31:14,549 --> 00:31:12,080
i had the impression maybe a dozen

849
00:31:17,430 --> 00:31:14,559
people were walking around the campsite

850
00:31:20,070 --> 00:31:17,440
we both froze until the noises stopped

851
00:31:23,190 --> 00:31:20,080
the apathy we'd experienced before bed

852
00:31:24,950 --> 00:31:23,200
was long gone in its place was abject

853
00:31:26,950 --> 00:31:24,960
terror and panic

854
00:31:27,830 --> 00:31:26,960
i tried once more to get through to my

855
00:31:29,990 --> 00:31:27,840
friend

856
00:31:30,950 --> 00:31:30,000
toby tell me what happened tell me who's

857
00:31:33,430 --> 00:31:30,960
out there

858
00:31:35,350 --> 00:31:33,440
but why even ask i knew who was out

859
00:31:37,669 --> 00:31:35,360
there i knew them

860
00:31:38,789 --> 00:31:37,679
toby didn't answer me i thought he was

861
00:31:40,549 --> 00:31:38,799
in shock

862
00:31:42,549 --> 00:31:40,559
frustrated i struggled to my knees to

863
00:31:44,789 --> 00:31:42,559
see what was going on in the meadow

864
00:31:46,630 --> 00:31:44,799
with my left arm i pushed toby back a

865
00:31:47,669 --> 00:31:46,640
bit and gathered the courage to look for

866
00:31:49,990 --> 00:31:47,679
myself

867
00:31:51,750 --> 00:31:50,000
i was fully awake now and the mental fog

868
00:31:53,830 --> 00:31:51,760
had mostly lifted

869
00:31:55,990 --> 00:31:53,840
squeezing next to toby i pulled back the

870
00:31:58,310 --> 00:31:56,000
canvas and there it was

871
00:32:00,789 --> 00:31:58,320
this wasn't a flying saucer at all it

872
00:32:02,389 --> 00:32:00,799
was something else something much bigger

873
00:32:04,789 --> 00:32:02,399
this was something i had never seen

874
00:32:07,110 --> 00:32:04,799
before and was unprepared for

875
00:32:08,549 --> 00:32:07,120
it was so gigantic that it filled every

876
00:32:11,590 --> 00:32:08,559
inch of the meadow

877
00:32:14,149 --> 00:32:11,600
it sat motionless in midair i estimated

878
00:32:16,789 --> 00:32:14,159
it to be 30 feet off the meadow floor

879
00:32:19,430 --> 00:32:16,799
then it registered of course this is the

880
00:32:21,590 --> 00:32:19,440
thing we watched last night before we

881
00:32:23,909 --> 00:32:21,600
went to sleep in the tent we had been

882
00:32:25,430 --> 00:32:23,919
staring at something in the sky

883
00:32:28,029 --> 00:32:25,440
i remembered we were watching the

884
00:32:31,190 --> 00:32:28,039
triangle in the sky but it was about

885
00:32:32,870 --> 00:32:31,200
2500 feet above us last evening

886
00:32:35,190 --> 00:32:32,880
this was the thing that generated so

887
00:32:36,389 --> 00:32:35,200
much disinterest in us just hours

888
00:32:37,750 --> 00:32:36,399
earlier

889
00:32:39,909 --> 00:32:37,760
unbelievable

890
00:32:42,230 --> 00:32:39,919
now it was 30 feet over the meadow we

891
00:32:44,549 --> 00:32:42,240
could see two sides clearly there were

892
00:32:47,350 --> 00:32:44,559
randomly dispersed square panels of

893
00:32:50,230 --> 00:32:47,360
light on each side it reminded me of a

894
00:32:52,310 --> 00:32:50,240
five-story office building at night with

895
00:32:53,190 --> 00:32:52,320
offices lit here and there on every

896
00:32:55,269 --> 00:32:53,200
floor

897
00:32:57,509 --> 00:32:55,279
along the very top was a row of larger

898
00:33:00,230 --> 00:32:57,519
windows that slanted outward

899
00:33:02,870 --> 00:33:00,240
they were all lit i saw faint shadows

900
00:33:04,710 --> 00:33:02,880
and movement behind these larger panels

901
00:33:06,549 --> 00:33:04,720
these larger panels stretched the entire

902
00:33:08,070 --> 00:33:06,559
length of the two sides of the triangle

903
00:33:10,149 --> 00:33:08,080
we could see

904
00:33:12,310 --> 00:33:10,159
the forest was quiet but for a load

905
00:33:13,430 --> 00:33:12,320
droning sound that reverberated in my

906
00:33:15,110 --> 00:33:13,440
chest

907
00:33:17,830 --> 00:33:15,120
toby shoved his way over my left

908
00:33:20,070 --> 00:33:17,840
shoulder now and we watched together we

909
00:33:21,669 --> 00:33:20,080
saw figures walking and milling around

910
00:33:24,149 --> 00:33:21,679
underneath this thing

911
00:33:26,630 --> 00:33:24,159
my god they were children maybe a dozen

912
00:33:28,389 --> 00:33:26,640
or more kids all about the same height

913
00:33:29,909 --> 00:33:28,399
they were milling about in small groups

914
00:33:32,230 --> 00:33:29,919
of two or three

915
00:33:33,830 --> 00:33:32,240
i whispered to toby what the hell are

916
00:33:35,990 --> 00:33:33,840
children doing here underneath this

917
00:33:37,909 --> 00:33:36,000
giant thing in the middle of the night

918
00:33:40,389 --> 00:33:37,919
there was fear in toby's voice when he

919
00:33:42,470 --> 00:33:40,399
answered those ain't little kids those

920
00:33:44,710 --> 00:33:42,480
are not human beings terry

921
00:33:46,389 --> 00:33:44,720
they took you too they heard us both

922
00:33:49,029 --> 00:33:46,399
terry they heard us

923
00:33:51,350 --> 00:33:49,039
his voice faded into soft sobbing again

924
00:33:53,509 --> 00:33:51,360
i placed my left arm across his shoulder

925
00:33:55,669 --> 00:33:53,519
and he leaned against me crying like a

926
00:33:58,389 --> 00:33:55,679
child unquote

927
00:34:00,710 --> 00:33:58,399
so let's pause there and step back and

928
00:34:02,710 --> 00:34:00,720
think back on what we've just read what

929
00:34:05,590 --> 00:34:02,720
we've just discussed in terms of the

930
00:34:08,550 --> 00:34:05,600
case of terry lovelace but also how his

931
00:34:10,950 --> 00:34:08,560
case has so much overlap with many many

932
00:34:13,349 --> 00:34:10,960
other experiencer accounts

933
00:34:15,270 --> 00:34:13,359
like many experiences perhaps even most

934
00:34:18,230 --> 00:34:15,280
is more accurate to say

935
00:34:20,710 --> 00:34:18,240
terry's experiences began in childhood

936
00:34:22,710 --> 00:34:20,720
when he saw these so-called monkey men

937
00:34:25,109 --> 00:34:22,720
that's what he nicknamed them because of

938
00:34:26,710 --> 00:34:25,119
the strange mask that they wore

939
00:34:29,430 --> 00:34:26,720
and then later he had an experience

940
00:34:31,829 --> 00:34:29,440
where he saw a ufo in broad daylight

941
00:34:33,669 --> 00:34:31,839
even though no one else saw it

942
00:34:36,230 --> 00:34:33,679
now undoubtedly these kinds of

943
00:34:37,909 --> 00:34:36,240
experiences were disorienting for terry

944
00:34:39,750 --> 00:34:37,919
as a young child

945
00:34:41,750 --> 00:34:39,760
but like many experiencers this

946
00:34:44,550 --> 00:34:41,760
eventually goes into the background as

947
00:34:46,869 --> 00:34:44,560
he grows older these memories and these

948
00:34:49,190 --> 00:34:46,879
nightmares seem to fade to some degree

949
00:34:51,909 --> 00:34:49,200
and he goes long periods without hearing

950
00:34:54,869 --> 00:34:51,919
from or seeing anything anomalous

951
00:34:56,470 --> 00:34:54,879
paranormal or related to ufos or aliens

952
00:34:58,390 --> 00:34:56,480
whatsoever

953
00:35:00,870 --> 00:34:58,400
and that's why we flash forward to this

954
00:35:02,310 --> 00:35:00,880
experience at devil's den

955
00:35:03,910 --> 00:35:02,320
because there was a long period where

956
00:35:05,589 --> 00:35:03,920
nothing happened

957
00:35:07,349 --> 00:35:05,599
but we shouldn't let that fool us

958
00:35:10,230 --> 00:35:07,359
clearly it seems that the data is

959
00:35:12,790 --> 00:35:10,240
telling us that some people are selected

960
00:35:15,349 --> 00:35:12,800
from a very young age perhaps from birth

961
00:35:17,390 --> 00:35:15,359
or before because again the data tells

962
00:35:20,069 --> 00:35:17,400
us that many of these are

963
00:35:22,310 --> 00:35:20,079
multi-generational scenarios where

964
00:35:24,069 --> 00:35:22,320
multiple generations are being abducted

965
00:35:26,069 --> 00:35:24,079
and perhaps having their genetics

966
00:35:27,910 --> 00:35:26,079
altered in some ways

967
00:35:29,829 --> 00:35:27,920
the evidence suggests that perhaps three

968
00:35:32,630 --> 00:35:29,839
or four generations of this has already

969
00:35:34,790 --> 00:35:32,640
been going on in our civilization

970
00:35:37,990 --> 00:35:34,800
now in the case of their camping trip

971
00:35:39,829 --> 00:35:38,000
quote unquote to devil's den state park

972
00:35:41,750 --> 00:35:39,839
we already made note of the fact that

973
00:35:44,390 --> 00:35:41,760
them even deciding to go there seemed

974
00:35:46,710 --> 00:35:44,400
like a setup of sorts that that notion

975
00:35:49,190 --> 00:35:46,720
had been implanted in their minds but it

976
00:35:51,670 --> 00:35:49,200
wasn't of their own volition it wasn't

977
00:35:54,950 --> 00:35:51,680
their idea this is basically an example

978
00:35:57,430 --> 00:35:54,960
of inception where the idea is birthed

979
00:35:59,510 --> 00:35:57,440
in their minds by these others

980
00:36:01,910 --> 00:35:59,520
and then once they get to the campsite

981
00:36:04,470 --> 00:36:01,920
they decide to go to a very remote area

982
00:36:06,470 --> 00:36:04,480
away from everyone else and in the case

983
00:36:08,390 --> 00:36:06,480
of the campsite they decide to go to

984
00:36:10,550 --> 00:36:08,400
sleep without even undressing or

985
00:36:12,710 --> 00:36:10,560
unleashing their boots which when you

986
00:36:14,790 --> 00:36:12,720
look back on what happens later seems

987
00:36:17,430 --> 00:36:14,800
like it's a prime example of these

988
00:36:19,430 --> 00:36:17,440
others prepping these two men for an

989
00:36:21,589 --> 00:36:19,440
abduction that's going to happen

990
00:36:23,430 --> 00:36:21,599
now when terry later wakes up after the

991
00:36:25,270 --> 00:36:23,440
abduction has happened

992
00:36:27,750 --> 00:36:25,280
they both see these small figures these

993
00:36:30,550 --> 00:36:27,760
small grey aliens that tarry mistakes

994
00:36:33,030 --> 00:36:30,560
for children walking around outside

995
00:36:34,310 --> 00:36:33,040
before long these small aliens walk

996
00:36:36,630 --> 00:36:34,320
underneath the light that is being

997
00:36:39,030 --> 00:36:36,640
projected from the center of this

998
00:36:41,430 --> 00:36:39,040
massive triangular craft and they seem

999
00:36:43,510 --> 00:36:41,440
to then be materialized straight up into

1000
00:36:46,310 --> 00:36:43,520
the craft and then it slowly and then

1001
00:36:48,790 --> 00:36:46,320
more rapidly departs from the area

1002
00:36:51,030 --> 00:36:48,800
the two men sit in terror for some

1003
00:36:52,870 --> 00:36:51,040
period of time before deciding they want

1004
00:36:54,470 --> 00:36:52,880
to get out of there they do not want to

1005
00:36:56,310 --> 00:36:54,480
spend the rest of the night they are

1006
00:36:58,150 --> 00:36:56,320
ready to get going

1007
00:37:00,790 --> 00:36:58,160
so mustering all of their strength and

1008
00:37:02,310 --> 00:37:00,800
their courage they rush to their car and

1009
00:37:03,990 --> 00:37:02,320
start driving back

1010
00:37:06,550 --> 00:37:04,000
now again what's interesting here is

1011
00:37:08,150 --> 00:37:06,560
their behavior is not as predicted

1012
00:37:09,829 --> 00:37:08,160
because neither one of them wants to

1013
00:37:12,069 --> 00:37:09,839
talk about what happened

1014
00:37:14,230 --> 00:37:12,079
they just both seem to be kind of mute

1015
00:37:16,550 --> 00:37:14,240
and drive back silently

1016
00:37:18,230 --> 00:37:16,560
once they get home both of their wives

1017
00:37:19,589 --> 00:37:18,240
are surprised they're back early and

1018
00:37:21,030 --> 00:37:19,599
wonder why

1019
00:37:23,030 --> 00:37:21,040
but it's very clear based on the

1020
00:37:25,589 --> 00:37:23,040
physiological condition of these two men

1021
00:37:27,589 --> 00:37:25,599
that something traumatic has happened

1022
00:37:29,829 --> 00:37:27,599
and so it is arranged for them to have a

1023
00:37:32,069 --> 00:37:29,839
medical checkup done at the military

1024
00:37:34,069 --> 00:37:32,079
hospital once they have answered some

1025
00:37:35,670 --> 00:37:34,079
basic questions and they're very careful

1026
00:37:37,750 --> 00:37:35,680
to not say too much because they don't

1027
00:37:39,670 --> 00:37:37,760
want to reveal what really happened for

1028
00:37:41,750 --> 00:37:39,680
fear that they'll be discharged for

1029
00:37:43,750 --> 00:37:41,760
being considered crazy

1030
00:37:46,550 --> 00:37:43,760
but nevertheless they share enough that

1031
00:37:49,109 --> 00:37:46,560
seems to trip some sort of flag that

1032
00:37:51,270 --> 00:37:49,119
gets the attention of the upper echelons

1033
00:37:53,910 --> 00:37:51,280
of the military establishment and they

1034
00:37:55,349 --> 00:37:53,920
are soon visited by agents that ask them

1035
00:37:58,150 --> 00:37:55,359
a series of questions even though

1036
00:37:59,910 --> 00:37:58,160
they're still both in a very rough shape

1037
00:38:02,470 --> 00:37:59,920
and as i mentioned at the outset of this

1038
00:38:05,910 --> 00:38:02,480
podcast they end up undergoing a very

1039
00:38:08,069 --> 00:38:05,920
intense investigation by the usaf office

1040
00:38:10,230 --> 00:38:08,079
of special investigations

1041
00:38:11,990 --> 00:38:10,240
they are even given a truth drug to make

1042
00:38:14,390 --> 00:38:12,000
sure that they tell the truth and then

1043
00:38:16,310 --> 00:38:14,400
they are hypnotized specifically we hear

1044
00:38:18,550 --> 00:38:16,320
about terry's situation where he is

1045
00:38:20,950 --> 00:38:18,560
hypnotized and the questions that he is

1046
00:38:23,270 --> 00:38:20,960
asked and what's astonishing about this

1047
00:38:25,430 --> 00:38:23,280
case is that it seems that the military

1048
00:38:28,069 --> 00:38:25,440
knows more than they are letting on that

1049
00:38:29,670 --> 00:38:28,079
something about the two men's story tips

1050
00:38:31,990 --> 00:38:29,680
off the military that this must have

1051
00:38:35,109 --> 00:38:32,000
been an abduction case that they saw

1052
00:38:37,829 --> 00:38:35,119
something to do with a ufo and perhaps

1053
00:38:40,230 --> 00:38:37,839
alien beings the nature of the ensuing

1054
00:38:43,030 --> 00:38:40,240
interrogation makes that very clear

1055
00:38:44,829 --> 00:38:43,040
these military agents seem to know much

1056
00:38:47,589 --> 00:38:44,839
more than they should if this is an

1057
00:38:49,670 --> 00:38:47,599
unknown phenomena for the military but

1058
00:38:51,109 --> 00:38:49,680
no they seem to know plenty

1059
00:38:53,190 --> 00:38:51,119
and in fact the person that is

1060
00:38:55,030 --> 00:38:53,200
interrogating them hypnotizing them

1061
00:38:57,109 --> 00:38:55,040
makes side comments to these agents

1062
00:38:59,910 --> 00:38:57,119
saying that much of what these men have

1063
00:39:02,150 --> 00:38:59,920
experienced is very common the apathy

1064
00:39:04,870 --> 00:39:02,160
the control of behavior what they see on

1065
00:39:06,950 --> 00:39:04,880
board the craft etc it seems to follow a

1066
00:39:09,270 --> 00:39:06,960
narrative that the military is very

1067
00:39:11,430 --> 00:39:09,280
familiar with and that is fascinating

1068
00:39:12,470 --> 00:39:11,440
and perhaps disturbing i'm sure you'll

1069
00:39:14,230 --> 00:39:12,480
agree

1070
00:39:16,230 --> 00:39:14,240
now next time on point of convergence we

1071
00:39:18,310 --> 00:39:16,240
will pick up where we leave off here

1072
00:39:20,790 --> 00:39:18,320
discussing in detail the military's

1073
00:39:22,950 --> 00:39:20,800
strange response including the nature of

1074
00:39:25,510 --> 00:39:22,960
the hypnotic regression session they are

1075
00:39:27,510 --> 00:39:25,520
subjected to as well as the series of

1076
00:39:30,150 --> 00:39:27,520
events that lead to the sudden end of

1077
00:39:33,270 --> 00:39:30,160
toby and terry's friendships as well as

1078
00:39:35,910 --> 00:39:33,280
terry decades on finding alien implants

1079
00:39:38,390 --> 00:39:35,920
inside his leg as well as the process of

1080
00:39:40,790 --> 00:39:38,400
him coming to peace with the experience

1081
00:39:43,349 --> 00:39:40,800
and then deciding to go public

1082
00:39:46,310 --> 00:39:43,359
we'll also discuss an apparent hybrid

1083
00:39:48,630 --> 00:39:46,320
being that seemed to watch over terry

1084
00:39:50,870 --> 00:39:48,640
and try to comfort him when these

1085
00:39:53,510 --> 00:39:50,880
abduction experiences were happening

1086
00:39:56,150 --> 00:39:53,520
we'll also discuss this hybrid's warning

1087
00:39:58,790 --> 00:39:56,160
that by going public terry is putting

1088
00:40:01,270 --> 00:39:58,800
his life at risk but not by the hand of

1089
00:40:05,109 --> 00:40:01,280
the aliens but rather by the hands of

1090
00:40:07,670 --> 00:40:05,119
the military that knows what terry knows

1091
00:40:09,349 --> 00:40:07,680
and on that note we've come to the close

1092
00:40:11,190 --> 00:40:09,359
of another edition of the point of

1093
00:40:13,030 --> 00:40:11,200
convergence podcast

1094
00:40:14,990 --> 00:40:13,040
if you'd like to support this podcast

1095
00:40:16,710 --> 00:40:15,000
you can do so by going to

1096
00:40:18,550 --> 00:40:16,720
patreon.com

1097
00:40:20,630 --> 00:40:18,560
exo academian

1098
00:40:22,470 --> 00:40:20,640
but until next time friends from deep

1099
00:40:25,829 --> 00:40:22,480
within the blue ridge mountains of north

1100
00:40:27,330 --> 00:40:25,839
carolina this is exo academian signing